still my subject of the posting shows what way the indian muslims to select .so please go through again .hope u have the idea of bringing out the word fundamentalsts during the period of KARSEVA ,IN 1989.into the usage of the political context in india .i do not mind whatever u call like others who knows only the names without looking the practice in the interaction of other people in the area in daily life where they lives .i respond to those only who drag me into their fixed imagination of the charector by name only without looking the whole -heart within the laxman rekha of the law of the land in such a way with a spirit to pull out the cover of their own face of hate and poisonous pill in the mind through the subject and argument only .
in my personal life have seen good-ness in sharing the tables without touch of the long sign of the AIR with each others with any-discontentment by keeping in mind that could hurt the differentiations from each others including rss cadre
if u all those who want to see the all the muslims singing the song through the proposal of the bjp .go and amend the constitution then u can ask to those who do not follow the law .if not even then those who do not oblige teach them with guns
ayub mohammed
shadikatyal
Dear Ayub,
I have noticed in your writing that you have even questioned the
Constituion of India . Is it possible that as a minority with all
given rights you still feel being judgemental on others view point.
It isd evident that you niether have faith in Indian Constituion nor
in Judges as you keep repaeting Hindu fundamentalist or generally
Hindus. It is evident that you may have studied with them but have
never tried to feel their feelings either of hate or love.
It is unfortunate that such incidents are carried far far away from
the reality.It is this type of publicity which is used to excite the
illitrates and uneducated masses.When I have tried to impress on you
that I feel same way as others and you that there whould be n o
imposition on any one but it is people like you and Dr. sherwani who
wish to creat some kind of fireworks.
The question which you have eluded so far is Why go to court or
object while this very song was sung by Maulana Azad and even Jinnah.
They had no ojections but now suddenly it has become a question of
religion. Who is more fundamentlist than your and Dr. sherwani
writings.I presume since Mulana Azaad was with Congress some of the
fundamentlist may even call him misled muslim.I presume the present
President is all in same boat.
The problem with India is her failure to have Uniform Code Bill.It
was foolish to keep postponing this one as as years go by there will
be more incidents and more bloodshed. People of all race and
religion live in europe and USA and obey the constituional law as
there is no special laws for minorities or any faith.Every student
has to take Oath of aligiance in US school but no one has come to
object it. You have see3n what France has declared because of
Uniform Law. Lack of such Lasw in India has also created lot of
misunderstanding and rumors of subsidy for Haj etc are common to
excite people.
IO have not seen any writing against terrorism in India and
specially Kashmir but lot about Military injustice which was
circulated by Amensty International which is again financed by Suadi
Arabi. It is not an honest party either.
regards
shadi
--- In issuesonline_ worldwide@ yahoogroups. com, ayub mohammed
>
> my dear friend mr lal
> those who does not have analysing capacity of the argument with
point of reason and ground under the indian constitution would
never find the facts and merits of the discussions who present with
endurance
> those who do not have the own mind and thinking power on the
subjects and issues do need more training like a parrot trapped in
the cage of hindu fundamentalism who do not seek the peace then how
would u seek the same from others. suspecian is some kind of mental
disorder of the indivdual who some time asks his own sons to show
their another father and his home would never be in peace .except
carrying the JHANDA .by making his own DHANDA ...hindu
fundamentalism ,,,,,,
> ayub mohammed
>
> Lal Gehi
wrote: THIS SMELLS
LIKE A PAKISTANI STYLE PROPAGANDA AND AGENDA. !!
>
> MR. AYUB,
>
> PEOPLE LIKE YOU HAVE TRIED TO DESTROY THE PEACE OF MUSLIM
COMMUNITY IN UK, USA, AND OTHER COUNTRIES OF THE WORLD, WITH
TERRORIST ACTIVITIES, AND DIVIDING PROPAGANDA, NOW, YOUR EVIL AXE
FALLS ON PEACEFUL SOCIETY OF INDIAN MUSLIMS. !!
>
> " VULTURES OF OWN CULTURE " , ALL IN THE NAME OF RELIGION. !!
>
> Peace. Lal Gehi
>
>
>
> ayub mohammed
> my dear friend mr.shadi ,
>
> very glad on catching the pulse of the point in arguement .in
democracy ,secularism and guarentee of the minority rights in the
written constittution the state as an instrument of the hindu-
fundamental forces violating the rights of the minorities through
its communal agenda against minorities and perticularly muslims by
imposing conditionalities unneccessarily on religions with a view
to divert the attention from the long pending problems of the
nation and the people who has right to ask the governments for its
redressal as a citizens of our nation under cover of uniting the
different castes people of hinduism against the minorities and
muslims without having the class aspect of the poor by serving
national,multinatio nal companies in dark at the cost of blood of
muslims and minorities like a gang of wild animals in ancient
societies
> if the rss,vhp,bajrandal and vahinies do not form the face like
bjp in political platforms and the bjp do not use the communal
weapons in a manner which does not match the animal like nature and
moving symbols of blots on the face and humanity and indian society
what would make the muslims and minorities to raise the small issue
and negligible error in practicing islam which is purely individual
and individual case in its original nature that would be depended
up on individuals practices and does not need to represent the
whole issue through the muslim leaders and islamic
organisations .the bjp which has change its policy and agenda from
the socialism to communalism that made it to catch more than 80 mp
seats from 2 only .were we not here that time ? why they did not
come before the people with such communal agenda during the nehru-
indira gandhi periods ?who wanted to dig the graves of the
history ? why do they want to get the history to the future .just
for
> seats ,political power ,luxaries, serving the rich ,dividing
the society on communal lines ? who wanted to glorify the past
which have no concerned in the government programmes and policies
to implement ?
> who are communal ? does the muslims have any national party at
national level to commit genocide ?
> every society and the people in real sense needs the progressive
agenda to fasten the social factors for the development of the
society and peace to the humans with the help of scientific
knowledge and development .we all indians no one should have
communal agenda for just power that too bends before the feet of
the rich class like a watchmen at the at the brothel houses where
the whores and brokers have perfect understanding .
> any way mr shadi thank u very much
>
> ayub mohammed
>
> shadikatyal
> Dear Ayub,
>
> It is very kind of you to tell me that you did not object
reading
> Ramayana and praying in the school. You also admit that you were
> loved and treated as equal.
>
> I think Mr. Ghai and others have explained to all os us that
Vande
> Matrem was sang by all nationalities as a national song. I
presume
> now the objection is beause of BJP.
>
> I agree that nothing should be forced on anyone and there
whlould be
> no compulsion. I have expressed my feelings on that openly. The
> objection in this case by a few people is not the song or
compulsion
> but BJP Govt as it did creat nothiong but mahem by destroying
Babari
> Masjid. The very fact that it is BJP is the concern amnd time
will
> tell when some one takes it to courts.
>
> regarding your remarks about sacrifice by Muslims, no one have
> questioned that. It is also in the history of India that country
was
> divided for the muslims and by the muslims. It is also there in
the
> hostory that Direct Action by Jinnah in 1946 started the blood
bath.
> I have lived through that and well aware what it did to millions
of
> families on both sides and some completely dispeared. We could
have
> learnt somthing from there as the fabric of Indian society was
torn
> apart and instead of trying to heal those wounds we continue to
> spread venom of hate.We should be working against this hate and
> instead of heading such articles as this song aginst Islam, we
could
> have taken simple route of asking why make anything compulsory.
> Dr. sherwani took the negative route and started this hate
compagin.
>
> Regards
> shadi
>
> --- In issuesonline_ worldwide@ yahoogroups. com, ayub mohammed
>
> >
> > my dear friend
> > plz read again how we interact each other.with the grounds
that
> led us to this point. u only know about the routime through urs
> masters poetry in a manner that does not recognize the other
> thoughts,reasons and multicultural dimension of our home-land
that
> have been laboured by all sections of that period in which
muslims
> were fore runners in sacrifices too .so plz read indian history .
> > i do not bother we the muslims were all daliths,backward
castes
> and some upper castes at that time .the question arises why they
> left the hindu fold is not a question for now bcos when i was
> schooling the prayer was about to read half an hour by the
> management which with full of rss cadre .and i got first prise
in
> answering ramayana in my school as i was only one out of ten
> including all hindus .but i did not feel them like hindus at the
> same time they also treated me like their family member .
> > my argument here is still with a hope to present the point
that
> no one should impose any practice upon those who does not
beleive
> in compulsory type practices any where and in any country.
> > here singing vande mataram is not a problem and it is a matter
> of negligible error by the muslims but conditionality and
coercion
> that not admissible in accordence with the provisions of indian
> constitution
> > my list is filled with more foreigners than the indians .but
> not with the pakistanis .plz check again
> > ayub mohammed
> >
> >
> > shadikatyal
> wrote:
> > Dear Ayub,
> >
> > I have failed to understnd your argument when I have already
> told
> > you that Indian Constituion protects the rights of every
citizen
> > without any class or cast or religious differences but some
how
> that
> > is also not acceptable to you. I will defend anyone rights
when
> such
> > laws are imposed but to start arguments before any reason has
no
> > justification. You also are against the motherland and I wonder
> if
> > you are an Indian citizen because the list of your groups
shows
> more
> > of Pakistan.
> >
> > All I see in your letters is the hate for Hindus whether
> > Fundamentalist or otherwise. May I remind you that bollod in
our
> > viens are from the same Hindus forfathers as 90% of muslim in
> Indian
> > subcontinet were Hindus. I will not go into why or how one
> converted
> > but the very fact that we are related should be enoiugh to
show
> some
> > aspect of respect.
> >
> > Paksitan was created on the same arguments which are
presenting
> and
> > I dont see now that majority of Indians are going to tolaerate
> any
> > kind of disloyality. Yes you can start again the slogan whcih
> was
> > familiar in 40's "Islam is in danger". The only nation which
> this
> > ploy has been used. Why mislead the public. If by any chance
you
> are
> > not Indian than my suggestion is to keep out of Indian Muslims
> > affaires.
> >
> > regards
> > shadi
> >
> > --- In issuesonline_ worldwide@ yahoogroups. com, ayub mohammed
> >
> > >
> > > my dear friend
> > > i know u come fast to the point which is set on the issue
> that
> > puts on the litmus test to those who have their rights
> guarenteed
> > in the indian constitution .praise of mother land is no wrong
> but
> > making it as an issue is a mistake and those who want to fix
in
> the
> > frame of the hindu fundamental forces as their tatget is the
> > biggest mistake like more than anti national and anti social
> under
> > the cover of police ,cultural police ,,,,in india .so the
> > minorities have the right to challenge such moves by the hindu
> > fandamental forces in the courts as citizens with costs and
> content
> > gurenteed by the law of the land.the state has its moral duty
> to
> > protect all citizens as per its constitution but all such
> forces
> > entered with wrong way with ignrance of laws relating to the
> > elections and keeping the adminstration impartial without
> bias .but
> > the theives enters the rulers uniform for their ends .so there
> is
> > great need to show their nakedness in performing their duties
as
> > > rulers as they failed to act like humans while dealing with
> > other humans in india atleast to say on the ground of the
> criminal
> > record of indian administration on the pages of the social
> charge
> > sheet of the governments they occupy .
> > > ayub mohammed
> > > ayub mohammed
> > >
> > > shadikatyal
> > wrote:
> > > Dear Mr. Ayub,
> > >
> > > I agrtee with you that nation and her welfare comes first
> and
> > thus
> > > Indian consitituion have made provisions to protect all her
> > citizens
> > > and given equal rights hwereas one cannot say of many other
> > nations.
> > >
> > > I have tried to keep the race,religion, creed etc out of
> this as
> > > fiath is a personal thing and any discussion is futile.
> > >
> > > I also donot agree with any compulsion by any government
> which
> > may
> > > creat rift but what I have failed to understand is that this
> > bvery
> > > national song which have been sung by all nationalist of hue
> and
> > > colour have suddenly become a non muslim. Was Maualan Azad.
> a
> > > birlliant theolgin not a muslim when he sang this or Jinnah
> who
> > > later partitioned the nation? Is it sinful to sing in praise
> of
> > your
> > > motherland? Why are we spreading such hate in name of fiath?
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > Shadi
> > >
> > > --- In issuesonline_ worldwide@ yahoogroups. com, ayub mohammed
> > >
> > > >
> > > > my dear friend
> > > >
> > > > my views are firm and based up on the historical facts
> > emerging
> > > from the need of the society but my reaction would be
> different
> > in
> > > such a way who present the case and act on the national
> > importance
> > > within the pervive of the constitution and laws of the
> land .my
> > > work and contributions are in perfect way and i keep it go
> on
> > with
> > > specified object of the universalility within the meaning
> of
> > the
> > > welfare of the humans who have the universal nature that
> would
> > > never be limited to the words ... MYSELF,MY CASTE,MY
> RELIGION
> > AND
> > > MY NATION
> > > >
> > > > ayub mohammed
> > > >
> > > > shadikatyal
> > > wrote:
> > > > Dear Mr. Ayub,
> > > >
> > > > India being a nation of all religions and cast and creed
> > have
> > > > provided this clause where one can take the case to the
> > courts.
> > > You
> > > > should start devoting your time and energy on that
> instead
> > of
> > > > writing such articles and stoking the fires of hate.
> > > >
> > > > The Constituion writers were well aware that time may
> come
> > when
> > > some
> > > > ideas may differ and thus minorities will have to be
> > protected.
> > > I
> > > > would hae thought that one would have given credit to
> the
> > > > Constitution instead of bashing the nation and
> majorities.
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > > shadi
> > > >
> > > > --- In issuesonline_ worldwide@ yahoogroups. com, ayub
> mohammed
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Minorities should move to the high courts and
> supreme
> > > courts
> > > > on vande mataram
> > > > >
> > > > > Clause (1) , Article 29 ,of Indian constitution
> > related
> > > to
> > > > the protection of interests of minorities in India and
> says
> > > > that "any section of the citizens residing in the
> territory
> > of
> > > > India or any part thereof having a distinct language,
> > script,
> > > and
> > > > culture of its own have the right to conserve the
> same ".In
> > > this
> > > > regard those who are under the list of minorities
> including
> > > Indian
> > > > muslims who have their own language, and culture have to
> > > challenge
> > > > the orders of state governments aganst the direct
> > intervention
> > > into
> > > > the minorities affairs and violating the Indian
> > constitution in
> > > the
> > > > high court and supreme court before 7th September.
> > > > > It is the bjp and its forces in all fields which
> are
> > all
> > > > most filled through the silent organizing methods and
> > skills
> > > have
> > > > long history in India to raise the issues that put the
> > > secularists,
> > > > communists and muslims in the witness box of the social
> > check
> > > in
> > > > all houses and parliament with their advanced network
> in
> > ship-
> > > > shaped manner through which they can lead the whole
> society
> > > against
> > > > their opposite forces in every field , under the name
> of
> > > > nationality, and patriotism.
> > > > > The target of the hindu fundamentals is the
> muslims
> > and
> > > > comminists on wider scale in general.if we see their
> > attitiude
> > > and
> > > > practice in its so called hindu spectrul they isolate
> the
> > lower
> > > > casts from the top position of the hindu hierarchy as a
> few
> > and
> > > > selective Brahmins against the largest poor and back
> ward
> > > section
> > > > of the hindu society at the cost of their material
> benefits
> > in
> > > > particular
> > > > > They only release the oral and non beneficial
> issues
> > on
> > > the
> > > > face of the nation under the broader sense of the
> > nationalism
> > > and
> > > > patriotism like nazis for the political power that
> proved
> > > nothing
> > > > in the interest of the poor and lower classes of the
> > society
> > > and
> > > > served only a few of the high and upper caste people
> since
> > last
> > > > fifteen years.
> > > > >
> > > > > In latest controversy they raked up should be
> > challenged
> > > in
> > > > the high courts concerned and the supreme court silently
> > without
> > > > popularizing the evil designs of such forces in the
> > interest of
> > > the
> > > > society and the country with the help of communist
> parties,
> > > secular
> > > > forces and the professional experts in defeating these
> > forces .
> > > > > Ayub mohammed
> > > > > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/political_ analysts/
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
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